[1eyedjack]

Do "Flash" and "Java" do essentially the same thing, but in different languages? I mean, like VHS and Betamax, or blue-ray and HD etc?

[TylerE]

Not really. Anything flash can do, Java can do, but the reverse isn't true.

[akhare]

We are talking about two slightly different things here.

Flash is a browser plug-in that can be used to write cross platform browser based client side applications.

Java refers to a language that can be used to write both client and server side applications. Java programs are translated into byte code and run on top of a JVM (Java Virtual Machine) that can be hosted on a variety of platforms.

The initial purported purpose of Java was indeed to cross browser and cross platform applications (using AWT, SWING, etc), but its use of late is largely on the server platforms.

[1eyedjack]

I get the impression that Java has been around for rather longer than Flash. If you can accomplish anything in Java that you could otherwise do in Flash, how has Flash gained a foothold?

[hotShot]

Flash used to be a platform to display vector graphics, that evolved over little animations to interactive graphical applications.

Java has always been a platform for system- and browser independent programs based on a very good security concept.

[fred]

1eyedjack, on Nov 8 2008, 08:19 PM, said:

I get the impression that Java has been around for rather longer than Flash.  If you can accomplish anything in Java that you could otherwise do in Flash, how has Flash gained a foothold?

As I understand it, the original purpose of Flash was to make it possible to enrich web pages with fancy graphics. Flash is not really a programming language.

Nowadays there is a powerful programming language (Actionscript) that can be used to develop programs (like BBO's Flash client) that use the Flash engine to provide the graphics that people see when these programs are run.

There are also development tools (like Flex, the one I use) that make it easier for people to create and debug Actionscript programs and which provide an extensive library of "classes" that programmers can use to make their lives easier. For example, that thing we use in the Flash client to display tournaments of various types is based on a Flex class called an "Accordian". It would take a lot of programming effort to create an Accordian-like control yourself, but by using existing classes that were developed and tested by other people, a programmer can save himself a lot of work.

I have done some work in Java too, but not for many years. I suspect there is not much you can do in either Flash/Actionscript/Flex that you cannot do in Java as well (and vice versa) at least on the client side. As Akhare correctly points out, Java is also a reasonable choice as a programming language for server side applications.

My original experiences with Java were not entirely positive, mostly because (at the time) the claims of "platform indendence" were largely exaggerated. I suspect that things have improved since then, but one of the main reason we chose Flash (instead of Java or something else) is that nowadays most computers have the Flash plugin installed. For those that do not, it is very fast and easy to install. As far as I can tell the same is not true of Java (but this is not exactly my area of expertise).

Fred Gitelman
Bridge Base Inc.
www.bridgebase.com

[barmar]

From the non-techie, end user's perspective, Flash and Java are used for similar things: running advanced applications in web browsers. Because of its historical origins, Flash is used more for graphics-intensive applications, while Java tends to be used for more tradional, computation-oriented applications with simpler graphical needs (you can do animation in Java, but it's not its forte). And I'm not even sure Java does streaming video, whereas it's now possibly the major use of Flash.

I don't think you encounter much Java on typical consumer web sites these days (don't confuse Java with Javascript, which is totally unrelated and quite common). It's more common in enterprise applications, where flashy animation is not so important.

And since I brought it up, Javascript is basically used to automate browser actions, as well as to implement simple augmentations to the browser (e.g. displaying pop-ups when your mouse moves over something). See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AJAX for a description of AJAX, the advanced techniques that use Javascript to enhance web pages.