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Can Standard American distinguish between 3 card and 4 card responder support of a 1M opener?
Eric Rodwell says that it can.
Can SAYC?
I have several sets of notes on SAYC/SA and they do not mention any way of distinguishing between 3 card and 4 card support by responder of a 1M opener.
Many thanks.
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Can SA Distinguish Between 3 & 4 Card Support
#2
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Posted 2011-February-15, 20:10
Depends on the range.
If it's game-forcing strength, then you have Jacoby 2NT available.
If it's weaker, then you cannot determine it (unless you decide to play bergen raises or something).
If it's game-forcing strength, then you have Jacoby 2NT available.
If it's weaker, then you cannot determine it (unless you decide to play bergen raises or something).
Wayne Somerville
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Posted 2011-February-15, 20:40
Standard American means different things to different people....
Some play that 1M-3M shows four-card support. Invites with three-card support would then start with a 2/1 bid and raise opener's major at the next turn.
However, this is not the SAYC treatment. The SAYC document is specific that 1M-3M can be either three or four-card support. This obviously is a disadvantage on invitational hands (although perhaps not as big of one as people think, since it does also help opponents on lead to know the degree of support). In SAYC, a 2/1 bid followed by raising the major (to the three-level, not a simple preference) shows a game force with three-card support, whereas a game-force with four-card support goes through 2NT. This allows you to distinguish on the GF hands, which is arguably more important. It also gives you a sensible way to bid game forces with three-card support, which the version of "Standard American" above really can't, since after 1M-2x-2y both 2M (preference) and 3M (invite) would be non-forcing.
Some play that 1M-3M shows four-card support. Invites with three-card support would then start with a 2/1 bid and raise opener's major at the next turn.
However, this is not the SAYC treatment. The SAYC document is specific that 1M-3M can be either three or four-card support. This obviously is a disadvantage on invitational hands (although perhaps not as big of one as people think, since it does also help opponents on lead to know the degree of support). In SAYC, a 2/1 bid followed by raising the major (to the three-level, not a simple preference) shows a game force with three-card support, whereas a game-force with four-card support goes through 2NT. This allows you to distinguish on the GF hands, which is arguably more important. It also gives you a sensible way to bid game forces with three-card support, which the version of "Standard American" above really can't, since after 1M-2x-2y both 2M (preference) and 3M (invite) would be non-forcing.
Adam W. Meyerson
a.k.a. Appeal Without Merit
a.k.a. Appeal Without Merit
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Posted 2011-February-16, 04:50
gurgistan, on 2011-February-15, 19:04, said:
Can Standard American distinguish between 3 card and 4 card responder support of a 1M opener?
Eric Rodwell says that it can.
Can SAYC?
I have several sets of notes on SAYC/SA and they do not mention any way of distinguishing between 3 card and 4 card support by responder of a 1M opener.
Many thanks.
Eric Rodwell says that it can.
Can SAYC?
I have several sets of notes on SAYC/SA and they do not mention any way of distinguishing between 3 card and 4 card support by responder of a 1M opener.
Many thanks.
Never doubt Mr Eric Rodwell !!!
But are you sure, you read well....and understand it correctly ?
What did he write exactly ?
♥Bob Herreman ♥
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