[mikeh]

ArtK78, on 2014-February-07, 10:34, said:

I have seen others state that the Q ask isn't even forcing to the small slam, as they can sign off below slam opposite a negative reply. I have always thought that any ask after the initial key card ask guarantees all of the key cards. But others make an exception for the Q ask, as they are willing to bid the small off one key card if the partnership has the trump Q.

Interesting: an occasional partner, who is a multiple national champion, and I had this come up in a home game.

I held Axx AKxxxx Kxx x and he opened a 20-21 2N.

I decided to texas and keycard. To my surprise he showed only 1 keycard.

We are off an Ace and there is room to be missing the trump Q as well. So I can afford to ask for it. Note that since I used texas, he will show me the Q if he holds 4 trump, so the only time I am missing a decent slam is if he holds Jxx. If the best it can be is playing AKxxxx (no 10) opposite Jxx for no losers, then I don't mind missing it.

So I asked and he bid 5♠ showing the heart Q and the spade K.

What to do?

I was confident I knew exactly what to do. Given that we have 34 hcp (he can't have 19+, even tho we both like to upgrade, because we'd never upgrade a hand with only 1 Ace), we can't be off an AK.

Indeed, we might easily have 35 hcp and if his hearts are Qx (or even, on a bad day, Qxx) we could be failing in 6♥. There might be A♦ and a ruff or, more likely, a bad trump split. If hearts run, then both 6N and 6♥ are cold, and if hearts don't run we may easily have 12 winners anyway: only needing 3 heart tricks.

I accordingly bid the obvious 6N and he started to think.

He finally bid 7♥ and they led the diamond Ace. He thought I had promised all the keys

[ArtK78]

Zelandakh, on 2014-February-07, 10:55, said:

Art, these particular queen asks are above the level of 5 of the agreed suit so this should be a try for grand and forcing to at least a small slam should certainly be the case. If the queen ask is below 5 of the agreed suit then it is typically not forcing to a small slam.

Yes, these Q asks were certainly forcing to the small slam. But suppose the asker needs more than just the trump Q? He should be able to ask for the trump Q and get a response that says yes or no and, if yes, I also have this king (or don't). The responses should not be limited to bid the grand with the Q and the small without the Q.

[Zelandakh]

ArtK78, on 2014-February-07, 11:44, said:

The responses should not be limited to bid the grand with the Q and the small without the Q.

In this we agree 100%. I have also postulated the idea of using bids like this as a way of investigating 6NT versus 6 of the suit, at least at MPs. It is generally possible to construct the responses so as to make this a genuine possibility.

[TWO4BRIDGE]

Zelandakh, on 2014-February-07, 12:06, said:

ArtK78, on 2014-February-07, 11:44, said:

The responses should not be limited to bid the grand with the Q and the small without the Q.

In this we agree 100%. I have also postulated the idea of using bids like this as a way of investigating 6NT versus 6 of the suit, at least at MPs. It is generally possible to construct the responses so as to make this a genuine possibility.

Diferences in replies to Q-ask ( ♥ are trump ) :
A)
5S! ( ask is ABOVE 5-of-trump ) - ??
................. 5NT = ♥ Q and MAY or may not have the ♠K ( the " asking suit " ).
................. 6H = NO ♥ Q

B)
5D! ( ask is BELOW 5-of-trump ) - ??
................. 5H = NO ♥ Q
................. 5S = ♥ Q and ♠ K
................ 5NT = ♥ Q ; NO ♠ K ; but have ♦ K ( the "asking suit " )
................. 6C = ♥ Q ; ♣ K; but NO ♠ K or ♦ K