[eagles123]

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what is 4h?

thanks

Eagles

[mgoetze]

I would guess spades and a minor.

[broze]

I think it should show one of two handtypes: either 1) spades and a minor, or 2) a 3-suited takeout 5=0=4=4. One thing is for sure it guarantees five spades.

With spades p bids spades, with clubs and no spade tolerance they bid 5C and p corrects to 5D if he has S and D. If p has diamonds he bids 4N and opener bids 5C with C and S, and 5D with the other two hand types (or more if he has a very strong hand).

[helene_t]

Spades+minor is what I would assume without having discussed it, but it may not be optimal. It takes away a lot of bidding space so I think it should be more specific. Maybe spades+clubs. Then with spades and diamonds you can just bid 3♠.

[mikeh]

Those who say spades and a minor have lived very sheltered lives. I'd want to be sure that my RHO is a solid citizen before believing that partner isn't simply bidding his heart suit.


Psychic bidding has gone out of favour these days but I absolutely know players who would be able to overcall in hearts if they held very long spades.

However I suspect that most players have never seen this done so in most games I would agree spades and a minor or 5044.

[BillPatch]

I have not had a sheltered life. If our agreement is that our undiscussed bids are natural, a fine old default agreement adopted in Bridge World Standard, 4♥ is a suggestion of a final contract. Double shows a notrump hand, possibly without a ♥ stopper.

[broze]

I don't believe this situation is analogous to 2♣-(2x)-P-(P); 3x where 3x should definitely be natural. The difference is that because we are in a forcing pass we can pass and wait for partner to reopen.

[wank]

Spades and a minor. You expose a psyche by penalty doubling and bidding hearts when they run.

[FrancesHinden]

I also think double = strong balanced, 4H = hearts. With spades and a minor I pass, which is always 2- or 3-suited.

[broze]

So when the opps start psyching our suit over our strongest bid and take up two levels of bidding we just say "fine" and start describing our hand as a heart one-suiter at the four level instead of penalising the opponents? That gives them so much credit for having a safe spot to run to - who knows, 4 minor or even 3 spades could be a disaster for them after their partner has hanged them by raising.

Not only this but by passing the 3H bid we are describing our hand as either two suited with spades and a minor, or three suited with 5 spades, or three suited with four spades. No definition at all.

[Phil]

Double = takeout
Pass = balanced
4♥ = ....wait for it......Natural!

[ArtK78]

Phil, on 2015-March-14, 17:37, said:

Double = takeout
Pass = balanced
4♥ = ....wait for it......Natural!

+1

[lycier]

Obviously,the exact meanings of 4♥ is 4144 with singleton in ♥ or 4054 or 4045 with voidness in ♥.

[Taiwan_up]

He has strong hand so he wants to hold the contract. 4H shows he hates hearts very much. You must bid your suit to support him.

[helene_t]

Taiwan_up, on 2015-March-15, 05:11, said:

He has strong hand so he wants to hold the contract.

The 2♣ opening already showed this.

[zillahandp]

It shows either astrong two suiter with spades or three suiter. 4nt would be minors so he must have spades, double could be passed but again would show spades just more happy to take pens. Many other answers nonsense.

[gszes]

Bridge is a game of probability and the amount of times I have seen my opps bid and raise my strong 2 suit (and we are talking a HUGE number of years) has been well ZERO. Even worse, it seems obvious that we would score better in 3hx than we will playing 4h so maybe it is in our best interests to not play that 4h is natural. With spades and another suit it will almost always be best to start with 3s so if we are going to take up an entire bidding level to get our point across it should be for an action that is pretty darn precise. I would vote for 4144 (23+)4045 4054 5044 (all 21+).

This analysis takes into consideration that the original pass by responder showed some values (2 Q +) and that if we had passed 3h it is construed as take out in case responder had a penalty pass of 2h. Agree with wank that if somehow we really had hearts it is far better to x then bid 4h when they run.

[WesleyC]

I've played a lot of hands of bridge and i've never had an opponent psyche 2H over my strong 2C.

On the time that they do manage to raise 2H into 3H into my AKQxxx i'll pass in tempo and hope that partner doubles.

In reality 4H shows some big 2 suiter with 5+S.

[redbird97]

2 suiter with Spades being the anchor.

[jodepp]

First, there has been some discussion about the 2♥ call being psychic. In my part of the USA such bids are not unheard of.

If there is worry that doubling 3♥ would be interpreted as takeout when you actually have hearts and want to double for penalty, that might be enough to avoid doubling and just hoping partner fields 4♥.

The upshot is: if you haven't discussed what 4♥ means, the default meaning is 'it's natural'. If I haven't discussed it and I had spades and a minor, I would not force partner to guess what 4♥means. Good partners don't put undiscussed bids into the middle of delicate auctions. In this case I would just bid 3♠ or 4♠.