[silvr bull]

kenberg, on 2014-May-04, 09:23, said:

I can imagine that at least some partnership somewhere has sat down and said "Let's play it this way".

I bid 4♥. I can hope that partner holds something like xxx AQxx Qx Kxxx, and he passed 1♠ because of the ♠ and ♦ weaknesses. I also prefer an immediate take out double of 3♠ to tell my story quickly, and then let partner make the hard decisions.

I have a KISS rule I discuss with partners that says if partner has bid anything (other than pass), then any double (except obvious negative or responsive situations) below 3NT is for penalty. Conversely, if partner has not bid anything other than pass, then any double below 3NT is 100% take out. That rule is obviously not the way many other people play, but it does give us clarity in otherwise ambiguous situations like this.

[aa_sen]

jdgalt, on 2014-May-04, 17:28, said:

This is exactly why I conclude it can't logically be takeout...

I totally agree with Kenberg and Jdgalt. The first few posters who said bidding 4H is automatic, left me feeling that I was missing something. But like Jdgalt says, if partner really has a strong hand without strong spades, why on earth did he or she pass 1S? It must be that partner is taking a chance for contract to go down and swinging for the fences as it is the last hand of the match. Plus my own strong hand makes our prospects look rather good. My own shortness in S also supports the idea that partner has long S (4 carder). Maybe partner has KQ10x of S, and as partner (South) is over long S hand (East), he or she expects to make 3 S tricks, and is hoping for a couple more tricks in other suits.

[ArtK78]

aa_sen, on 2014-May-04, 23:22, said:

Maybe partner has KQ10x of S, and as partner (South) is over long S hand (East), he or she expects to make 3 S tricks, and is hoping for a couple more tricks in other suits.

The opponents, who are leading, have opened 1♠ and preempted 3♠ and you are hoping that partner has KQTx of spades? Sorry, not possible.

You can take the chance that you are going to do serious damage to 3♠x, but it won't be because of trump tricks. And that is why I bid 4♥. If you can beat 3♠ without a trump stack (and I submit that there is no possible trump stack) then you may be able to make 4♥.

[kenberg]

jdgalt, on 2014-May-04, 17:28, said:

This is exactly why I conclude it can't logically be takeout. If partner were strong enough that we can make 4 of anything, either he should have overcalled at his first turn, or he should have bid his long suit. If he's got some kind of two suiter, he should have bid Michaels or 2NT. Since none of these happened I can only infer that he was trap-passing and has a spade stack. If anything else is going on, he wants a mind-reader for his partner, and I don't qualify.

You will not be surprised to hear that I agree. Maybe I will make a point about "state of match" actions. Long ago I was playing a Swiss and my rho bid a very low percentage slam that made. This was early in the match and both pard and I pushed just a bit on every remaining board. It paid off, we won the match. What we did not do was something like this double. I don't know what partner intends, I see no way to figure out what partner intends. I don't think that is obviously anything. Doubling on the first round with a slightly less than optimal hand would be pushing things a bit, hoping for a lucky roll. Could happen. Here, who knows? Repeating myself, I think he has some defense, I'll play for that and pass. But I am hoping that my life does not hang in the balance here.

We appear to be in a definite minority on this.

[kenberg]

Youth wants to know: What's the winning call.

Youth? Age is a state of mind..

[inquiry]

I would bid 3NT, expecting partner to realize if I wanted to play that contract I would pass the double. I will correct 4 minor to 4hearts and again expect him to realize this is a four card suit willing to go to five of a minor.

Now you see why I never win and tend not to participate in bidding contest.