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Has U.S. Democracy Been Trumped? Bernie Sanders wants to know who owns America?

#16441 User is offline   johnu 

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Posted 2020-October-06, 13:23

View Postshyams, on 2020-October-06, 09:13, said:

Then, it will be apt to say "People are corporations too" :)

That been absolutely true since 2010 with the Supreme Court Citizens United decision. About the only thing corporations can't do is vote, which doesn't matter because they can literally buy millions of votes with unlimited expenditures.
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#16442 User is offline   shyams 

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Posted 2020-October-06, 13:36

View Postjohnu, on 2020-October-06, 13:23, said:

That been absolutely true since 2010 with the Supreme Court Citizens United decision. About the only thing corporations can't do is vote, which doesn't matter because they can literally buy millions of votes with unlimited expenditures.

My attempted jest was based on the original remark by Romney which was "Corporations are people too". IIRC he made it during his Presidential bid.

Then the implications was that Corporations should be "people" when it favours the Corporations; be independent legal entities when it doesn't favour being "people". The twist now is that perhaps people can turn it around and choose their legal status based on which is beneficial.
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#16443 User is offline   Winstonm 

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Posted 2020-October-06, 13:56

I think Trump's base has finally been discovered: it's two guys, sitting in a bar in Queens, watching pro wrestling, and bitching about pro basketball players' makin' too much fu#$in money - but they know who holds Trump's debt, and they have the receipts.
"Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." Black Lives Matter.
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#16444 User is offline   y66 

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Posted 2020-October-06, 15:27

From Bloomberg:

Quote

Surprise! Trump’s Still Losing

An October surprise is sudden, last-minute news that alters the shape of a political race. True October surprises are surprisingly rare. But President Donald Trump really needs one to turn around the 2020 election.

Trouble is, he keeps springing the wrong surprises. Giving himself coronavirus probably won’t help him, even if his campaign is playing it as a strength. And Trump’s latest surprise — shutting down stimulus negotiations and tanking the stock market — also seems unhelpful.

Today brought a new raft of polls suggesting last week’s debate and the whole Covid-19 thing have put Trump even further behind his rival Joe Biden in both the national vote and swing states. Trump benefited from James Comey’s October surprise in 2016, and nobody should count him out this time, writes Jonathan Bernstein. But with every October day that passes, his chances grow slimmer, especially when he keeps sabotaging himself.

Political prediction markets echo the polls, as they will do. A lesser-known prediction engine, the Treasury bond market, is making its own bet, writes Brian Chappatta, and it’s starting to price in a blue wave that brings unified Democratic government. How can he tell? The yield curve — or the gap between short- and long-term interest rates — is steeper than it has been since the last time a party won the White House, Senate and House, in 2016:

Posted Image
The yield curve steepens, generally, when traders see stronger growth and inflation coming. It steepened in 2016 partly because they saw tax cuts and deregulation coming from Republicans. Now they may see stimulus coming from the Dems. Only another month of surprises until we find out.

The yield curve thing is for one of my favorite posters.
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#16445 User is offline   y66 

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Posted 2020-October-06, 17:23

Matt Yglesias said:

So McConnell blew it up for unclear reasons....

Quote

During their phone call today, Mitch McConnell suggested to Trump that Speaker Pelosi was stringing him along and no deal she cut with Mnuchin would could pass the Senate, per 2 ppl w/ knowledge of call

Trump blew up the talks shortly after the call.

https://www.washingt...stimulus-talks/

Edit:

Matt Yglesias said:

Generous aid to state & local governments, cash assistance to households, and low interest loans to businesses are like dexamethosone for the economy.

Emily Cochrane at NYT said:

President Trump on Tuesday abruptly ended talks with Democrats on an economic stimulus bill, sending the stock market sliding and dealing a final blow to an intensive set of on-again-off-again negotiations to deliver additional pandemic aid to struggling Americans before the November elections.

Mr. Trump announced that he was pulling the plug on the effort in a series of afternoon tweets in which he accused Speaker Nancy Pelosi of California of “not negotiating in good faith" and urged Senate Republicans to focus solely on confirming his nominee to the Supreme Court in the coming weeks.

Instead, Mr. Trump said that he had instructed Steven Mnuchin, the Treasury secretary, to stop negotiating, sending the S&P 500 down as much as 1 percent in the immediate aftermath of his tweet. It had been up more than half a percent in the moments before. The index closed down 1.40 percent for the day.

“Our Economy is doing very well,” Mr. Trump tweeted as the market fell. “The Stock Market is at record levels, JOBS and unemployment also coming back in record numbers. We are leading the World in Economic Recovery, and THE BEST IS YET TO COME!”

Ms. Pelosi and Mr. Mnuchin, who had previously been scheduled to speak later Tuesday afternoon, briefly spoke after Mr. Trump’s tweet, with Mr. Mnuchin confirming that the president had discontinued talks and Ms. Pelosi expressing disappointment “in the President’s decision to abandon the economic & health needs of the American people,” Drew Hammill, a spokesman for Ms. Pelosi, said on Twitter.

The president’s move came not long after Jerome H. Powell, the chairman of the Federal Reserve, had made his latest urgent plea for additional stimulus, warning that a failure by Congress to inject more federal help into the economy would risk weakening the recovery.

The announcement came after the president had spoken by phone with Mr. Mnuchin, Senator Mitch McConnell of Kentucky, the majority leader, and Representative Kevin McCarthy of California, the minority leader, according to two people briefed on the conversation.

It looks to me like Pelosi's promise to the airlines to bail them out regardless undercut her position.
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#16446 User is offline   y66 

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Posted 2020-October-06, 17:41

David Wasserman at NYT said:

The 10 Bellwether Counties That Show How Trump Is in Serious Trouble

In an era of stark political polarization, it is difficult to find any one place that is a true microcosm of the country. But it is possible to find places on which the November election pivots. These communities that hold the key to the vote are as varied as the nation — and they reflect a notable inversion of its politics.

Polls now show Joe Biden with a surprising opportunity to capture Sun Belt suburbs that have voted reliably Republican for decades. He is also performing better than Hillary Clinton did in 2016 — but perhaps not as well as Barack Obama did in 2008 and 2012 — in heavily white, historically blue Frost Belt small towns and midsize cities where Donald Trump enjoyed a breakthrough in 2016.

These 10 bellwether counties — five in Sun Belt battlegrounds, five in the Frost Belt (loosely defined to include Iowa) — could point us toward each state’s winner. They run the gamut from meatpacking hubs to white-collar office parks, and from peach orchards to yacht-dense retiree havens. But there is something they all have in common: Their votes will matter a lot.

To win the White House, Mr. Biden will need to flip some combination of the 10 states Mr. Trump carried by less than 10 points in 2016 (in ascending order of margin): Michigan, Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, Florida, Arizona, North Carolina, Georgia, Ohio, Texas and Iowa. Mr. Biden has several paths to victory, and the first three states alone, in addition to every state won by Hillary Clinton, would be enough to put him into the Oval Office.

Conversely, Mr. Trump would likely need to win at least eight of those 10 states for a second term. A look at these bellwethers — all either tossups or leaning toward Mr. Biden — makes clear that Mr. Trump is in serious trouble.

https://www.nytimes....pgtype=Homepage

If you lose all hope, you can always find it again -- Richard Ford in The Sportswriter
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#16447 User is offline   y66 

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Posted 2020-October-06, 17:53

NYT Editorial Board said:

In our endorsement today, the board wrote that above all else it is Biden’s promise to be a president to all Americans that argues most persuasively for his election. After four years of the most divisive president in modern times, this is both welcome and urgently needed. And what a therapeutic it would be.

Readers might notice that the board’s endorsement of Biden makes no mention of Donald Trump. The case for the former vice president needs no foil to make it stronger.

Also, the editorial board — which has been weighing in on Trump’s presidency for the past three and a half years — will issue its verdict on his term in office later this month.

To many readers, particularly younger ones, newspaper endorsements might feel like a vestigial organ, something from another time. We tried to bring some transparency — even some levity — to the process with our Democratic primary endorsement process.

Today, we’ve returned to the traditional form: the best choice, clearly stated.

“Biden knows that there are no easy answers,” the board wrote. “He has the experience, temperament and character to guide the nation through this valley into a brighter, more hopeful future. He has our endorsement.”

If you lose all hope, you can always find it again -- Richard Ford in The Sportswriter
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#16448 User is offline   Chas_P 

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Posted 2020-October-06, 18:41

Quote

Biden knows that there are no easy answers,” the board wrote. “He has the experience, temperament and character to guide the nation through this valley into a brighter, more hopeful future.

If that is, in fact, the case I wish him well should he win the election. We are all Americans and we all have the same hopes, dreams, whatever....life, liberty, happiness. I have mine. I wish the same for you.

#16449 User is offline   y66 

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Posted 2020-October-06, 21:31

Maggie Haberman at NYT said:

anniekarni and me on the latest in a White House where people are simultaneously stunned by the virus outbreak there and yet still unconvinced it's a serious illness.

Trump’s Return Leaves White House in Disarray as Infections Jolt West Wing

Quote

The White House that President Trump woke up in on Tuesday morning was in full-blown chaos, even by the standards of the havoc of the Trump era.

Aides said the president’s voice was stronger after his return from the hospital Monday night, but at times he still sounded as if he was trying to catch air. The West Wing was mostly empty, cleared of advisers who were out sick with the coronavirus themselves or told to work from home rather than in the capital’s most famous virus hot spot. Staff members in the White House residence were in full personal protective equipment, including yellow gowns, surgical masks and disposable protective eye covers.

Four more White House officials tested positive, including Stephen Miller, a top adviser to Mr. Trump, bringing to 14 the number of people carrying the virus at the White House or in the president’s close circle. Mr. Trump, diagnosed with Covid-19 last week, was still livid at his chief of staff, Mark Meadows, whose effort on Saturday to tamp down the rosy portrait of Mr. Trump’s condition given to reporters by his chief doctor was caught on camera. Other officials were angry with Mr. Meadows for not even trying to control the president.

Some aides tried to project confidence — “We feel comfortable working here, those of us who are still here,” Alyssa Farah, the White House communications director, said in an interview on Fox News — but many saw the situation as spiraling out of control. The pandemic that Mr. Trump had treated cavalierly for months seemed to have locked its grip on the White House. West Wing aides, shaken by polls showing the president badly trailing Joseph R. Biden Jr., worried that they were living through the final days of the Trump administration.

The disarray was at the same time spreading across Washington. Almost the entire Joint Chiefs of Staff, including its chairman, Gen. Mark A. Milley, went into quarantine on Tuesday after coming in contact with Adm. Charles W. Ray, the vice commandant of the Coast Guard, who tested positive for the coronavirus. Late in the day, the stock market took a dive when Mr. Trump abruptly called off talks for a congressional coronavirus relief bill after the Fed chair, Jerome H. Powell, said such a stimulus was badly needed.

Some White House staff members wondered whether Mr. Trump’s behavior was spurred by a cocktail of drugs he has been taking to treat the coronavirus, including dexamethasone, a steroid that can cause mood swings and can give a false level of energy and a sense of euphoria.

Staff members said the president was glad to be back in the White House after spending four days and three nights at Walter Reed National Military Medical Center, which aides said made him feel as if he were in a cage. Mr. Meadows and Bobby Peede, the director of the White House advance team, kept him company there for hours and served as a lifeline to the rest of the administration. He summoned another aide, Max Miller, on Sunday to stay with him.

Aides said that Mr. Trump made calls from the White House on Tuesday and roamed the areas of the presidential residence that had been set up for him. Although he was described as itching to get back into the Oval Office and show that he was in charge, a potential live address to the nation was discussed but scrapped in favor of a planned taped one.

Prominent supporters of the administration said Mr. Trump should have stayed at the hospital until he was no longer infectious or should remain confined to his residence.

“When a boss comes down with Covid, whether that boss is the president, a C.E.O., a principal at a school, a union foreman on a shop floor, and the boss shows up for work, it sends a very worrisome message to all of those around the boss,” said Ari Fleischer, a former press secretary to President George W. Bush. “There is a community of people who work in the White House, not just political appointees. A good boss always takes care of his or her employees.”

Still unknown was the exact status of the president’s health. Dr. Sean P. Conley, the White House physician, said on Tuesday that the president “reports no symptoms” of the virus and that his vital signs were stable, but no one at the White House would say what the “expected findings” were on Mr. Trump’s chest X-ray that Dr. Conley had mentioned over the weekend.

There were no answers, either, on when Mr. Trump last tested negative for the virus — a crucial piece of information that the White House and Dr. Conley have refused to answer and would establish the known state of Mr. Trump’s health before the presidential debate last Tuesday or before he attended a fund-raiser in New Jersey on Thursday. The White House first made public that Mr. Trump had tested positive early last Friday.

Two officials maintained that Mr. Trump had been tested before the presidential debate, but the White House has yet to affirm that.

White House officials conceded on Tuesday that there had been an impression created that Mr. Trump was getting tested every day, and a reliance on testing as if it were a curative measure as opposed to a diagnostic.

Yet the president himself was not tested every day, according to two people familiar with the practices. A senior administration official would only say on Tuesday that Mr. Trump was tested “regularly.” Mr. Trump himself told reporters in the White House briefing room in July that “I do take probably on average a test every two days, three days.”

As the day progressed on Tuesday, parts of the White House resembled a hazard zone. Workers dressed in head-to-toe protective suits sanitized common spaces in the West Wing, and staff members were told that the White House residence had hired a “well-being” consultant whom they could speak with anonymously, specifically to focus on mental health concerns.

Kayleigh McEnany, the White House press secretary who tested positive for the virus on Monday, appeared on television from her home. Hope Hicks, Mr. Trump’s close adviser who has also tested positive, had been trying to help with messaging for the videos the president shot at Walter Reed and the remarks on the virus he wanted to make upon his return.

And the finger-pointing continued.

Ms. Hicks had been upset last week that she was being blamed for infecting the president, according to three people who had spoken with her. She had not attended a Rose Garden event announcing Judge Amy Coney Barrett’s nomination to the Supreme Court and had tested positive for the virus on the same day as Mr. Trump and the first lady — making it just as likely that she had contracted the virus from the president.

Among White House advisers, anger grew at Ms. McEnany because her statement announcing her diagnosis appeared to blame Ms. Hicks. There was also frustration from many corners at Mr. Meadows for not doing more to try to protect the staff, a criticism that his defenders said was unfair given the scope of his duties.

On Monday night, some of the staff members still at the White House had gathered to watch Mr. Trump’s return. When he defiantly took off his mask on the Truman Balcony for a made-for-television moment, aides said it was of course a statement. But they also wondered if the face covering was making it harder for the president to breathe.

Either way, some of them shrugged off the message it was sending to tens of millions of Americans about taking the coronavirus seriously.

The sentiment, according to one aide to Mr. Trump, was that “it’s his house.”

Wow. This is too surreal.
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#16450 User is offline   kenberg 

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Posted 2020-October-07, 07:59

A quickie history of Pence and Harris debates, for those such as myself who need such things.

https://www.washingt...-harris-debate/

I think that tonight is a pretty big deal (and yes, I recall the extra adjective provided by Biden in describing the ACA). If I were to be given a four year task, I can imagine there would be interest in what happens if I am not around to complete it. Of course that's always the case with veeps, but maybe it is more so this time around
Ken
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#16451 User is offline   Winstonm 

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Posted 2020-October-07, 08:28

The best thing about the White House Covid outbreak is that Stephen Miller tested positive. If ever one human being deserves whatever awfulness befalls him, that is the guy. His isolation should be in a cage at the southern border.
"Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." Black Lives Matter.
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#16452 User is offline   y66 

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Posted 2020-October-07, 17:04

David Leonhardt said:

The gray revolt against Trump

President Trump is losing his fellow baby boomers. Their turnabout is the central reason he trails Joe Biden by a substantial — and apparently growing — margin.

Four years ago, Trump handily won his own generation, which is generally defined as being born between 1946 and 1964, while losing every younger generation. The Pew Research Center estimates that Trump beat Hillary Clinton by nine percentage points among voters 65 and older.

The latest polls this year show a radically different situation. A CNN poll released yesterday found Biden leading Trump by 21 points — 60 percent to 39 percent — among likely voters 65 and older. An NBC News/Wall Street Journal poll released Sunday found an even bigger gap: 27 points. Dave Wasserman of The Cook Political Report calls it “the ‘gray revolt’ against Trump.”

Why is it happening? Older Americans began to drift away from Trump even before the coronavirus. Some don’t like his “chaotic and unconventional presidency,” as Ella Nilsen of Vox points out. Others may be more open to supporting Biden than Clinton — given his gender and what polls show to be his lower negativity ratings and less liberal image. Baby boomers also have experience living in a less polarized country, when vote switching was more common.

But the virus seems to be a factor, too. Many older Americans understand that other countries have handled the virus better than the U.S. They are tired of the restrictions of pandemic life. And many boomers are afraid — for good reason, given that about 150,000 of the 210,000 confirmed U.S. virus deaths have occurred among people 65 or older.

There are only two age groups that continue to support Trump, according to Times polls conducted over the past month. The first is a narrow slice of people older than baby boomers, typically in their late 70s, who have long been conservative. The second is a group of middle-aged people who include the youngest boomers and the oldest members of Generation X:

Posted Image

The middle-aged group is less vulnerable to the disease than people over 65 (although they’re still vulnerable). The group is also more conservative than people under 40. Its members came of age during Jimmy Carter’s unsuccessful presidency, Ronald Reagan’s two terms in office and the U.S. triumph in the Cold War. My colleague (and fellow Generation Xer) Ross Douthat goes into more depth on conservative Xers here.

But winning only a couple of slices of the country’s age spectrum isn’t enough to win a presidential election. The CNN and NBC polls both showed Trump trailing by double digits nationwide. New polls yesterday showed him losing in Arizona, Florida, Michigan, North Carolina, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin.

Trump keeps telling people that the virus is not as bad as they’ve heard. Older Americans aren’t buying it.

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#16453 User is offline   Winstonm 

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Posted 2020-October-07, 18:23

More on Change-the-dates-gate: WaPo reporting:





Quote


The Justice Department said Wednesday that it inadvertently altered dates on copies of notes from two former senior FBI officials that were turned over to Michael Flynn's defense team and filed to the court as potentially exculpatory evidence.


The dates were added to notes of former acting FBI director Andrew McCabe and former FBI agent Peter Strzok and should have been removed before the documents were scanned by FBI headquarters, the Justice Department told a judge weighing its request to dismiss the former Trump national security adviser's prosecution. McCabe and Strzok were key figures investigating possible links between Russia and the Trump campaign in 2016.


An attorney for Strzok last week wrote the court saying that a copy of his notes filed by Flynn's defense added at least two dates that he did not write, and at least one suggested a White House meeting happened earlier than it did. An attorney for McCabe similarly wrote the court Friday that an erroneous, added date seemed to suggest he briefed the Senate Intelligence Committee about the Russia investigation on May 10, 2017, which did not happen.

At a hearing last week on the Justice Department's motion, U.S. District Judge Emmet G. Sullivan called the claim by Strzok "unsettling," and ordered prosecutors to certify under oath by Wednesday<b /> whether submitted materials "were true and accurate." Sullivan has said he would issue a written opinion on whether to dismiss Flynn's case "with dispatch."

Responding Wednesday, prosecutors disclosed that in Strzok's notes, dates were added by FBI agents participating in a review of Flynn's case that Attorney General William P. Barr assigned in January to U.S. Attorney Jeffrey Jensen of St. Louis.

The department said it was unclear who added a date to McCabe's notes.

"The government has learned that, during the review of the Strzok notes, FBI agents assigned to the EDMO [Jensen] review placed a single yellow sticky note on each page of the Strzok notes with estimated dates (the notes themselves are undated)," the department said.

"Those two sticky notes were inadvertently not removed when the notes were scanned by FBI Headquarters, before they were forwarded" to U.S. prosecutors in Washington to produce to Flynn, Assistant U.S. Attorney Jocelyn Ballantine of Washington, D.C., told the court.

Similarly, the government learned "at some point during the review of the McCabe notes, someone placed a blue 'flag' with clear adhesive to the McCabe notes with an estimated date," Ballantine wrote. "Again, the flag was inadvertently not removed when the notes were scanned by FBI Headquarters, before they were forwarded to our office for production."

A spokeswoman for McCabe declined to comment.

In a statement, Aitan Goelman, Strzok's lawyer, questioned the government's claim that the additions were unintentional.

"The government claims that the undisclosed alterations were a result of sloppiness and not a deliberate attempt to mislead," Goelman said. "It would be easier to give the government the benefit of the doubt if the alterations didn't fit a false narrative pushed by the President, or if they weren't made by a team specifically chosen by the Attorney General to provide political aid to President Trump, or if Bill Barr hadn't already demonstrated his willingness to cast aside the Department of Justice's tradition of neutrality in an attempt to help President Trump." my emphasis





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#16454 User is offline   Zelandakh 

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Posted 2020-October-07, 19:15

Huge mistake from KH - she did not push back on the MP lies about there being a complete travel ban from China nor on JB opposing it. Neither is true but when she lets it go the voters will think so. This is precisely what allowed MP to win the last VP debate and she should have been prepared for this.
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#16455 User is offline   kenberg 

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Posted 2020-October-07, 19:43

We shall see, but at the halfway mark I think KH is way out in front.
Ken
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#16456 User is offline   y66 

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Posted 2020-October-07, 19:49

KH is up on my card too. It looks like she's getting in her zone.
If you lose all hope, you can always find it again -- Richard Ford in The Sportswriter
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#16457 User is offline   y66 

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Posted 2020-October-07, 20:49

Peter Baker at NYT said:

Of the four candidates on stage in the last two weeks, only one of them had not served in nationwide office, and in that respect Senator Harris had more to prove than anyone else, to show that she is not only a credible vice president but a credible potential president given her running mate’s age. And she held her own. Whether anyone won or not, she came across as a plausible national leader. I don’t know that it changes anyone’s votes, but she probably did what she needed to do. As for Pence, he did not change the dynamics of the race at a moment when his ticket is losing, but he delivered a lot of the lines that his campaign wanted out there.

Trump is losing badly with women and older voters. I suspect these voters are calling this debate for Dems.
If you lose all hope, you can always find it again -- Richard Ford in The Sportswriter
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#16458 User is offline   y66 

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Posted 2020-October-07, 21:30

Mark Levine NYC Council said:

New COVID-19 cases in past week:

Vietnam - 5
Taiwan - 9
Yemen - 10
New Zealand - 25

White House - 34

If you lose all hope, you can always find it again -- Richard Ford in The Sportswriter
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#16459 User is offline   helene_t 

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Posted 2020-October-07, 21:50

The 25 cases in New Zealand were all either "historical" (patients that recovered long time ago but just hadn't been registered before) or imported cases still in in isolation. There hasn't been any community transmission for 13 days.
Can't have a baby if you do it contraclockwise! --- Jlall
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#16460 User is offline   y66 

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Posted 2020-October-07, 22:43

Bernie Sanders channeling kenberg said:

"Out of an abundance of caution," we should expand Medicare to cover everyone in America.

If you lose all hope, you can always find it again -- Richard Ford in The Sportswriter
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