[silvr bull]

There is a persistent problem in BBO tournaments. One or two players can take so much time to bid and/or play that there is little time left for the other players. I would like to see individual clocks for each player. They would act like chess clocks to run when it is the player's turn to bid or play, and then stop for that player after completing the bid or play. Then the clock would run for the next player until that player completes a bid or play, etc. The four clocks could be visible on the screen so it would be easy to see if one player is taking too much time. Without clocks, a director who gets to a problem table near the end of time for a round can do little more than assign an average score to all players, even though only one player may have used most of the wasted time. With clocks to help identify problem players, a director can decide to assign better scores to the non offenders and worse scores to time wasters. Just seeing the clock ticking time away could help motivate slow players to play more quickly. Individual clocks would be helpful even in casual games to encourage players to waste less time. Individual clocks would be a timely improvement!

[mycroft]

It would be nice if there was such a thing that the TDs could at least look at. However, the players need to be proactive about calling the TD before the end of the round.

There is *always* ways to game a system; the one that immediately comes to mind with this one is my GNT qual, where they *had* a weak NT defence, but it wasn't on their card, and they wouldn't explain it (even with the TD there). TD tells me "okay, if you have enough for this hand, play it, and ask for their full explanation before the next hand". So I did (oddly enough, I had a flat 13 as dealer). No response. I asked again. No response, other than "your bid, S". I stated I would call *after* I got the defence. "TD, he's not bidding". Good news was that a) I know the TD, and b) I'd already had the conversation last hand, so when I said "I'll bid when they answer the question you told me to ask", there it was. But all of that was sitting on my clock...

[johnu]

mycroft, on 2017-January-23, 11:03, said:

There is *always* ways to game a system; the one that immediately comes to mind with this one is my GNT qual, where they *had* a weak NT defence, but it wasn't on their card, and they wouldn't explain it (even with the TD there). TD tells me "okay, if you have enough for this hand, play it, and ask for their full explanation before the next hand".

Why wouldn't the director give them a PP and if they still wouldn't explain, have them forfeit the match?

[mycroft]

That, I believe, was the next set of words on the director's lips. I eventually, with him leaning on them, got enough of an understanding of their system that I thought I could go ahead and call. It wasn't enough - because they did overcall, and the explanation wasn't the agreement they told me about - but with us being a last-minute entry to avoid byes, and playing with effectively random pickups, we were 0-4 on our way to 0-6, and I didn't really care much. Were I in contention, I would have been a bit more forceful about it...

[johnu]

Sounds like it's time to file a player memo. The good news is that the ACBL has an online form these days, the bad news is that nobody knows if anybody ever looks at what is filed.

[mycroft]

Probably. I have to admit I couldn't be arsed to do anything other than finish the bloody session and get to the bar (given that our part of the game was held in the local Legion, the cheapest bar since The Old Club closed. This was very useful information!) I did get their names, though, and I'm looking out for them.

[penriquez1]

Why do u think would be the proper amount of time for one play to be allowed to bid?

[Stefan_O]

silvr bull, on 2017-January-23, 09:36, said:

.... Just seeing the clock ticking time away could help motivate slow players to play more quickly. Individual clocks would be helpful even in casual games to encourage players to waste less time. Individual clocks would be a timely improvement!

+1.
Great proposal.
Start by just displaying the clocks on the screen and see what effect that has.

[1eyedjack]

I already see a "round" clock (and I don't mean circular). For me personally it acts as a chivvy. Maybe not others.

[mycroft]

If you're the perenially slow player, you don't notice the round clock; when it goes low, it's because everybody's slow. Why should you make any more of an effort? This also applies the one time you actually get finished before someone else (i.e. only three minutes after the round's called, instead of five) and "but I couldn't start until way after the round, it's not my fault".

If you're usually on time, when the clock gets low for whatever reason (especially when it's been unusually tough for your side, but also when Dawdlin' Don's at the table again), it acts as a chivvy.

Guess who gets hurt by this?

I applaud the idea of personal clocks, even if the round clock is there. If we can point out that *every round*, you took half the round time, it's hard to complain. One round, however, as I said earlier, can be - and will be - gamed.

[miamijd]

silvr bull, on 2017-January-23, 09:36, said:

There is a persistent problem in BBO tournaments. One or two players can take so much time to bid and/or play that there is little time left for the other players. I would like to see individual clocks for each player. They would act like chess clocks to run when it is the player's turn to bid or play, and then stop for that player after completing the bid or play. Then the clock would run for the next player until that player completes a bid or play, etc. The four clocks could be visible on the screen so it would be easy to see if one player is taking too much time. Without clocks, a director who gets to a problem table near the end of time for a round can do little more than assign an average score to all players, even though only one player may have used most of the wasted time. With clocks to help identify problem players, a director can decide to assign better scores to the non offenders and worse scores to time wasters. Just seeing the clock ticking time away could help motivate slow players to play more quickly. Individual clocks would be helpful even in casual games to encourage players to waste less time. Individual clocks would be a timely improvement!

Sometimes this can be a problem. But there are other problems that feed into the overall issue. For example:

1. Some players don't alert bids they should, so then their opponents sometimes have to ask for explanations and wait until they get them (often you have to call the director)

2. Some players routinely reject even the most obvious claims, again resulting in a director call (NO, YOU CAN'T PLAY IT OUT). To say "well then just don't claim - play everything out" (as I have had opponents tell me from time to time) is nuts. Sometimes a hand is over after trick 4. Why play it out? Why not save time for the next hand that may require some deep thought?

3. Some players routinely play out the most obvious hands rather than claiming, and if I try to concede a certain number of tricks to help them out, reject that. I've even had opponents reject when I've tried to concede ALL the remaining tricks!

4. All hands aren't equal. I've seen opponents take 4 minutes to play a hand that is worth 30 seconds of time and then complain when I think for 2 minutes at trick one declaring the next hand (generally, about a minute later, I end up claiming, but they think every trick has to be played at the same speed).

We all have an obligation to try to get three hands in within 14 minutes. That's not that hard if (A) everyone alerts all alertable bids and provides the correct explanation with the bid and (B) declarers with simple hands claim early and defenders accept proper claims quickly. Indeed, when playing against strong players, I generally end up with 3-4 minutes on the clock when the round ends, even if 1-2 hands require considerable thought.

Cheers,
Mike