BBO Discussion Forums: undos - BBO Discussion Forums

Jump to content

Page 1 of 1
  • You cannot start a new topic
  • You cannot reply to this topic

undos allowing undos

#1 User is offline   mattie5 

  • Pip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 2
  • Joined: 2020-October-19

Posted 2020-October-19, 06:22

My understanding of the law appertaining to 'undos' is that a request for an undo may be made so long as the requester's partner has not indicated their intention by bidding or passing. Something like that. Recently, I was bidding a hand which had slam possibilities. I bid RCKB and partner responded 5 hearts, indicating 2 key cards without the trump Q. Up until this point the opposition had remained silent. I pondered my response for a few seconds but before making my next bid I noticed that my RHO, who had originally passed the bid of 5 hearts, then requested an undo. That request was not immediate. As was usual, the TD had instructed that undo requests could be made only during the bidding process and should be granted, so I agreed to the request. RHO then bid a double. I then bid 6 spades, which was defeated on a heart lead, trumped by RHO who then cashed a side ace. Even if I had wished to be able to deny the undo request the LHO would have been been made aware of the request and it would not have been difficult to surmise that LHO wished to convey that he/she wanted a heart lead. Has anyone got a view on whether undo requests should be permitted in such circumstances and whether the requester's partner should be made aware of the request?
0

#2 User is offline   Gerardo 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Admin
  • Posts: 2,482
  • Joined: 2003-February-12
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Dartmouth, NS, Canada

Posted 2020-October-19, 10:31

You say this was in an environment where there was a TD available.

Did you call him/her, and explained the situation?

#3 User is offline   pescetom 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 7,202
  • Joined: 2014-February-18
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Italy

Posted 2020-October-19, 11:03

Here is what the Laws of Bridge have to say about it:

Laws said:


LAW 25 - LEGAL AND ILLEGAL CHANGES OF CALL
A. Unintended Call
1. If a player discovers that he has not made the call he intended to make, he may, until his partner makes a call, substitute the call he intended for the unintended call. The second (intended) call stands and is subject to the appropriate Law, but the lead restrictions in Law 26 do not apply.
2. If the player’s original intent was to make the call selected or voiced, that call stands. A change of call may be allowed because of a mechanical error or a slip of the tongue, but not because of a loss of concentration regarding the intent of the action.
3. A player is allowed to replace an unintended call if the conditions described in A1 above are met, no matter how he may have become aware of his error.
4. No substitution of call may be made when his partner has made a subsequent call.
5. If the auction ends before it reaches the player’s partner no substitution may occur after the end of the auction period (see Law 17D).
6. If a substitution is allowed the LHO may withdraw any call he made over the first call. Information from the withdrawn call is authorized to his side and unauthorized to the opponents.


I would have started by calling the TD (whatever he told you), then asking whether the opponent may have originally intended to pass.
FWIW, I think a decision to allow an Undo at all is dubious when there is a Confirm Bid mechanism available (some RAs disagree).
It is certainly appropriate to involve the TD immediately.
0

#4 User is offline   mattie5 

  • Pip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 2
  • Joined: 2020-October-19

Posted 2020-October-20, 01:44

View PostGerardo, on 2020-October-19, 10:31, said:

You say this was in an environment where there was a TD available.

Did you call him/her, and explained the situation?


I did not call the TD because I could not be sure that I had noticed the undo request the second it was posted. I should imagine that the TD would have had the almost impossible task of discriminating between a mechanical error and a change of mind. What I should have done is ended the auction with a bid of 5 spades, anticipating the RHO's double to indicate a void, like a Lightener double. My problem is that LHO is made aware of the undo request, so whether it is granted or not, the damage has been done.
0

#5 User is offline   pescetom 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 7,202
  • Joined: 2014-February-18
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Italy

Posted 2020-October-20, 01:55

View Postmattie5, on 2020-October-20, 01:44, said:

I did not call the TD because I could not be sure that I had noticed the undo request the second it was posted. I should imagine that the TD would have had the almost impossible task of discriminating between a mechanical error and a change of mind.

If the TD decided or accepted to enable Undo then this is his problem, not yours. It is quite correct to set him the task. It would be less correct for you to accept the Undo in silence, bid slam and then call TD if it goes down on a hearts lead.
0

Page 1 of 1
  • You cannot start a new topic
  • You cannot reply to this topic

1 User(s) are reading this topic
0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users