[Tramticket]

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A simple negative double sequence. But what precisely does the double show?
- What does it show for your partnership?
- What does it show if undiscussed?

I think that this should be independent of system, but please state if you think basic system makes a difference.

[DavidKok]

In general all takeout-esque doubles show "I have some values and would like to make a bid, but do not have one available". The meaning is exactly 'the hand type(s) that cannot be shown through other calls'.
On the example auction, assuming a 5cM system, I play a pretty standard set of responses:

• 1NT: ~6-9, 2-♥, shows a spade stopper.
  
• 2♣: 5(+)♣, 2-♥, forcing, ~9+ points or so.
  
• 2♦: 5(+)♦, 2-♥, forcing, ~9+ points or so.
  
• 2♥: 3-4♥, approximately 4-8 points.
  
• 2♠: 3♥, approximately 9+ points (inv+).
  
• 2NT: 4(+)♥, inv(+).

Higher calls show some specific hands and particular types of heart raises. What is left are:

• ~6-9 hands with 2-♥ and no desire to bid 1NT, typically containing both minors (depending on partnership agreement: one long minor suit is also permissible, especially diamonds if you play equal level conversion).
  
• 10+ (semi)balanced hands with 2-♥ that do not want to blast 3NT and do not have a 5cm to bid. Some people reserve the 2NT bid as a natural call to show the ~10-12 hands on this auction, removing most of these hands from the double.

As a final remark I think it is quite a bit better to play artificial transfers here. The takeout double type is rare (and, ironically, still bids a double, without overloading the bid) and you get to show hands with a long suit regardless of strength. I think this approach is more suitable for a limited opening system such as strong club.

[Tramticket]

DavidKok, on 2023-April-13, 04:17, said:

typically containing both minors (depending on partnership agreement: one long minor suit is also permissible, especially diamonds if you play equal level conversion)

Do you play it as containing both minors? Or just one minor? Which is the better method and why? Which is the default method if you haven't previously discussed?

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Can you bid 3♣ in this type of auction, relying on partner to hold a four-card club suit?

[DavidKok]

It neither promises nor denies minor suit length. Personally I'd pass with a weak hand with a single minor, so 3♣ in your example is relatively safe (though I'd feel a lot more comfortable with a good/bad 2NT). There's still a risk though - on balance I don't mind doubling with, say, ♠xxx, ♥Kx, ♦QTxxx, ♣QJx, reasoning that you can pull 2♣ to 2♥ and accurately describe your hand. The spade raise indicates partner probably doesn't have this hand, but you never know.

I don't know which method is better, but I prefer to not double with a weak hand and a long minor suit. This gets into the whole 'forcing new suits versus negative free bids' debate. Transfers resolve the issue, but if you do not want to play those I prefer forcing new suits, pass weak hands, double only with (semi)balanced hands or both minor hands. With weak shape hands the bidding often gets competitive, so making a generic value-showing bid (double) when really you have a weak hand with a long suit tends to put a lot of pressure on partner. Either upgrade to a forcing 2m or sell out.
I think this is also default, but it's a rare auction and I would not be surprised to find that people have different styles here.

[helene_t]

The negative double can certainly be a 3244 hand with constructive values and no (positional?) spade stopper. 22(54), 31(54) and probably also 12(55) also fine. What other hands it can contain depends somewhat on the rest of the system:
- If playing natural forcing freebids, especially in the context of a strong notrump system, a minimum constructive hand with a weak 6-card minor (especially diamonds) is also possible. (53) minors also ok, probably even if playing negative freebids, especially if the 5-card suit is poor
- If playing 4-card majors, at least some hands with 3-card support also need to double. You may agree that a single raise of hearts can be a 3-card suit, but raises to the 3-level should show 4, especially in a strong-NT system
- A singleton hearts is not ideal but sometimes double is still the least flawed action. This is to some extent a question of partnership understanding