[gurgistan]

CSGibson, on Jul 31 2010, 02:09 AM, said:

Private
This indicates you do not wish a skill level to be displayed when people view your profile information.
Novice
Someone who recently learnt to play bridge
Beginner
Someone who has played bridge for less than one year
Intermediate
Someone who is comparable in skill to most other members of Bridge Base Online
Advanced
Someone who has been consistently successful in clubs or minor tournaments
Expert
Someone who as enjoyed success in major national tournaments
World Class
Someone who has represented their country in World Championships

So, you think that after two months of BBO, you qualified for an advanced ranking? Did you enjoy consistent success in club games or minor tournaments during that time (Open games only please; I don't care about your success in the 299er game)? Is 2 months a long enough evaluation period to determine consistent success?

I have a real problem with people who don't understand basic bidding passsing judgment on the skill level of others. Yes, partner should not have passed you in 4N, but did he pass because he didn't understand what you were asking, or because he was so frustrated that you obviously did not understand common bidding sequences, and passed out of spite?

These are very technical definitions. Are they your own or do BBO provide these as a guideline for players?

[gurgistan]

matmat, on Jul 31 2010, 02:26 AM, said:

gurgistan, on Jul 31 2010, 01:42 AM, said:

matmat, on Jul 31 2010, 01:26 AM, said:

Quote

I played on BBO for two whole months before I decided to describe myself as Advanced

Quote

I am not a very experienced player

Are you a troll?

possibly, though I thought I was just pointing out the slight hypocrisy in your posts

matmat please learn to live with your own hypocrisies and if I have any I will learn to live with mine.

You found two apparently contradictory posts in one thread by one poster on an Internet forum. I guess in the history of the World Wide Web this is a first. Not.

[gurgistan]

qwery_hi, on Jul 31 2010, 02:40 AM, said:

OP didn't see the contradiction, two months is sufficient restraint compared to the two weeks most people need to advance up from intermediate.

This.

[gurgistan]

hotShot, on Jul 31 2010, 03:23 AM, said:

If you join BBO and you feel that you are clearly better than the intermediates you met, what are you supposed to do?

This.

[neilkaz]

gurgistan, on Jul 30 2010, 11:56 AM, said:

A related point is that when players define themselves they usually do so based on their cardplay and not their bidding. My last regular partner (before we fell out lol) has far superior to myself in his cardplay but had a much smaller edge over me when it came to bidding. Indeed, he improved my cardplay and I improved his bidding (simply by introducing to newer, more precise, methods).

While the majority of players on BBO self rate themselves too highly, you don't have to and here's my advice based on a couple of things I've read in your thread and please take no offence.

1) You've stated that your ex-PD's card play is far superior to your's. Well, right there is a good reason to NOT call yourself Advanced. My suggestion is to study declarer play A LOT and also to make very certain that you understand basic defensive techniques and signalling. However, declarer play is the one area where you don't care whether your partner understands the "standard " 2♣ system, is on the phone, never signals or whatever. It's just YOU vs the two of THEM so study it lots and you'll be able to more often pull off endplays, simple squeezes and cope with bad breaks as well as avoiding finesses that you don't need since they risk an otherwise cold contract.

2) Maybe your bidding is Advanced, and you certainly are asking the right questions to expand your knowledge, but from your need for knowledge in the threads about 2♣ it is clear that you've got some learning to do. The 2♣ "system" isn't well understood by far too many players and I feel for you here with the posted hand since I've seen plenty of players who think that a 4♥ jump is stronger than a 3♥ raise there however, they are very wrong. However, I can't imagine too many who'd think that you actually want to play 4NT at imps on that sequence and would pass.

OK enough rambling, so I'll get to the point that I think you should self rate yourself Intermediate until your card play is improved. In your profile list details about what bidding methods you can play and make sure that you know them well and keep asking questions here. With a little more experience and some improved card play, I think you'll be clearly better than the "average" advanced on BBO in a few more months and can then happily and justifiably raise your self-rating to Advanced.

Just my thoughts .. neilkaz ..

[ggwhiz]

Playing on BBO for only two months doesn't mean you don't have a much longer history in the game.

World Class here means little without the gold star, not even expert since your ego dares to claim that.

Expert, 50-50 or so.

Given the distortion at the top levels, definng yourself honestly as intermediate or advanced becomes very problematic.

[qwery_hi]

gurgistan, on Jul 31 2010, 05:14 AM, said:

qwery_hi, on Jul 31 2010, 02:40 AM, said:

OP didn't see the contradiction, two months is sufficient restraint compared to the two weeks most people need to advance up from intermediate.

This.

See, matmat has a valid point too. You're not wrong doesn't necessarily mean he's wrong, and the other way around.

[gurgistan]

neilkaz, on Jul 31 2010, 10:03 AM, said:

gurgistan, on Jul 30 2010, 11:56 AM, said:

A related point is that when players define themselves they usually do so based on their cardplay and not their bidding. My last regular partner (before we fell out lol) has far superior to myself in his cardplay but had a much smaller edge over me when it came to bidding. Indeed, he improved my cardplay and I improved his bidding (simply by introducing to newer, more precise, methods).

While the majority of players on BBO self rate themselves too highly, you don't have to and here's my advice based on a couple of things I've read in your thread and please take no offence.

1) You've stated that your ex-PD's card play is far superior to your's. Well, right there is a good reason to NOT call yourself Advanced. My suggestion is to study declarer play A LOT and also to make very certain that you understand basic defensive techniques and signalling. However, declarer play is the one area where you don't care whether your partner understands the "standard " 2♣ system, is on the phone, never signals or whatever. It's just YOU vs the two of THEM so study it lots and you'll be able to more often pull off endplays, simple squeezes and cope with bad breaks as well as avoiding finesses that you don't need since they risk an otherwise cold contract.

2) Maybe your bidding is Advanced, and you certainly are asking the right questions to expand your knowledge, but from your need for knowledge in the threads about 2♣ it is clear that you've got some learning to do. The 2♣ "system" isn't well understood by far too many players and I feel for you here with the posted hand since I've seen plenty of players who think that a 4♥ jump is stronger than a 3♥ raise there however, they are very wrong. However, I can't imagine too many who'd think that you actually want to play 4NT at imps on that sequence and would pass.

OK enough rambling, so I'll get to the point that I think you should self rate yourself Intermediate until your card play is improved. In your profile list details about what bidding methods you can play and make sure that you know them well and keep asking questions here. With a little more experience and some improved card play, I think you'll be clearly better than the "average" advanced on BBO in a few more months and can then happily and justifiably raise your self-rating to Advanced.

Just my thoughts .. neilkaz ..

Thank you for your considered post, Neilkaz.

I am happy with my Advanced rating as in comparison to most Advanced players on BBO, I just am!

I am good enough for players to repeatedly partner and search me out.

And yet you clearly see the failings in my knowledge.

On some objective scale, I would be a strong Intermediate?

If I called myself Intermediate then all that would happen is that I would end up partnering Intermediates who are not good enough to be Intermediate.

I can live with partnering random Advanced players who are not Advanced.

Just about.

Thanks again for your considered and considerate post.

[billw55]

gurgistan, on Jul 31 2010, 10:29 AM, said:

If I called myself Intermediate then all that would happen is that I would end up partnering Intermediates who are not good enough to be Intermediate.

I really agree with this. Almost every BBO "intermediate" I have seen makes multiple basic errors. If I want to play with even modestly competent players I am forced to label myself advanced.

Of course, even then there are plenty of "advanced" and "expert" players who aren't. There's no real way around that. But the odds of getting an adequate partner are much higher.

In fact, I have seen more good players who self-label as novice or beginner, out of humility. The intermediate label only seems to draw players who don't want to be beginners, but who aren't good enough to label as advanced even in the context of BBO.

[CSGibson]

gurgistan, on Jul 31 2010, 06:08 AM, said:

CSGibson, on Jul 31 2010, 02:09 AM, said:

Private
This indicates you do not wish a skill level to be displayed when people view your profile information.
Novice
Someone who recently learnt to play bridge
Beginner
Someone who has played bridge for less than one year
Intermediate
Someone who is comparable in skill to most other members of Bridge Base Online
Advanced
Someone who has been consistently successful in clubs or minor tournaments
Expert
Someone who as enjoyed success in major national tournaments
World Class
Someone who has represented their country in World Championships

So, you think that after two months of BBO, you qualified for an advanced ranking?  Did you enjoy consistent success in club games or minor tournaments during that time (Open games only please; I don't care about your success in the 299er game)?  Is 2 months a long enough evaluation period to determine consistent success? 

I have a real problem with people who don't understand basic bidding passsing judgment on the skill level of others.  Yes, partner should not have passed you in 4N, but did he pass because he didn't understand what you were asking, or because he was so frustrated that you obviously did not understand common bidding sequences, and passed out of spite?

These are very technical definitions. Are they your own or do BBO provide these as a guideline for players?

BBO provides them.

[gurgistan]

CSGibson, on Jul 31 2010, 01:00 PM, said:

gurgistan, on Jul 31 2010, 06:08 AM, said:

CSGibson, on Jul 31 2010, 02:09 AM, said:

Private
This indicates you do not wish a skill level to be displayed when people view your profile information.
Novice
Someone who recently learnt to play bridge
Beginner
Someone who has played bridge for less than one year
Intermediate
Someone who is comparable in skill to most other members of Bridge Base Online
Advanced
Someone who has been consistently successful in clubs or minor tournaments
Expert
Someone who as enjoyed success in major national tournaments
World Class
Someone who has represented their country in World Championships

So, you think that after two months of BBO, you qualified for an advanced ranking?  Did you enjoy consistent success in club games or minor tournaments during that time (Open games only please; I don't care about your success in the 299er game)?  Is 2 months a long enough evaluation period to determine consistent success? 

I have a real problem with people who don't understand basic bidding passsing judgment on the skill level of others.  Yes, partner should not have passed you in 4N, but did he pass because he didn't understand what you were asking, or because he was so frustrated that you obviously did not understand common bidding sequences, and passed out of spite?

These are very technical definitions. Are they your own or do BBO provide these as a guideline for players?

BBO provides them.

Thank you for replying.

[fuburules3]

While I do notice that if you change your skill level to beginner and try to find a pick up partner people will avoid you and assume anything that goes wrong is your fault, I don't think if your skill level is "intermediate," that advanced players will typically avoid you.

If you don't have regular partners to play with, I'd just rent the GIB rather than play with random pick up partners.

[gurgistan]

fuburules3, on Jul 31 2010, 06:42 PM, said:

If you don't have regular partners to play with, I'd just rent the GIB rather than play with random pick up partners.

I am really intrigued by what a GIB is.

[blackshoe]

It's a bridge playing computer program.

[gurgistan]

blackshoe, on Aug 1 2010, 02:08 AM, said:

It's a bridge playing computer program.

Thank you.