[Free]

I would bid 3♥, it's usually easier to evaluate your hand after a SST imo. North has a clear accept over this.

4♠ is also acceptable since we're V in a team match...

[the hog]

42, on 2011-October-13, 03:18, said:

The following is a hand where my partner and I have completely different opinions on hand evaluation, as it seems.
System: Polish Club modified
Important team match
Dealer: South
N/S vulnarable

I hope that viewing the complete hand right now does not influence your objectivity

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Bidding so far:
South opens 1♠ (pass) 2♠ (pass)

Problem A: South has to decide whether to show via Rosenkranz Two-Way Game Tries
a) a short suit trial in ♥
b) a long suit trial in ♦
c) a long suit trial in ♣
or
d) to jump directly to 4♠
--> Question: Which is the best action and why? (Without knowing all hands as you do...)

Problem B: assume that South decided to bid
i) --> a) = a short suit trial in ♥
ii) --> b) = a long suit trial in ♦
--> Question: How should North evaluate his hand in each of both cases? Why?

C: Do "loser count" or "distribution points" affect your bidding?

D₁: Do you prefer "Long Suit Trials" or "Help Suit Trials"? D₂: Would LST or HST lead to a different result from North in this hand?

TIA!

I wonder how the 4S bidders will like their contract if partner tables
Qxx
KJxx
xxxx
xx
or similar
Why throw away IMPs when you have the option of numerous game tries?

[chasetb]

Without a doubt I would make a SSGT in ♥. The Club suit doesn't need much (any?) help from partner, and Diamonds aren't too much a worry. I prefer Help Suit tries compared to Long Suit tries, because part of the time they are the same thing, and part of the time when you or partner use a LSGT and it is turned down, you will make 4 because the wrong suit was asked about.

[mcphee]

I do not see game being good if partner has just 3 trumps unless you find a lot of help in your minors. Even facing a 3 card constructive raise the pump would easily spell defeat.

[phil_20686]

the hog, on 2011-October-15, 19:27, said:

I wonder how the 4S bidders will like their contract if partner tables
Qxx
KJxx
xxxx
xx
or similar
Why throw away IMPs when you have the option of numerous game tries?

I have been assuming that the 4S bidder think that north plays constructive raises, 8-10 with 3 cards or 7-10 with 4 cards. Or some such. I think that is "forum std" in 2/1 type systems.

If 2S was intended to be 4-9 as a simple raise then obviously south does not have a game drive. I am guessing OP has not posted enough to realise that the range of a 2S bid is something that people might play differently.

I would make a short suit game try opposite a simple raise. Opposite a constructive raise it is probably worth 4S but it is is pretty close.

[blackshoe]

Here's a hand I had the other day:

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Partner opened 1♥. Note that this hand has 7 losers. Partner should have 7 losers. Should you bid game?

Turns out partner has a balanced 13 count including the ♦QJ doubleton and no heart honors. You can't make more than 2♥. Raw LTC is wrong on this one.

[gwnn]

phil_20686, on 2011-October-18, 03:57, said:

I have been assuming that the 4S bidder think that north plays constructive raises, 8-10 with 3 cards or 7-10 with 4 cards. Or some such. I think that is "forum std" in 2/1 type systems.

I for one did not really think that and I definitely don't think it's forum std.

[MrAce]

I'd bid direct 4 ♠.

And we do not play constructive raises.

Here is a hand that i played lastnight in BBO, very similar to this and how i bid it. I am a firm believer of avoiding trial bids whenever i can, which helps defense a lot and has slim to none scientific effects on figuring the outcome of the contract. They make more sense at MP imo.

The hand South has in your example is much better than my 14. I am not saying this works all the time, change pd's ♠A and make it ♣ and i wld be in wrong contract, just posted this to tell u i wasnt influenced by seeing 4 hands. The plus scores i get due to wrong lead or defense from this style of bidding covers the wrong contracts and brings more in return imo. Also allows me to use most trial bid auctions for slam purposes.

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