Help
Partner could still be balanced, options now are basically 4♣ splinter (could be followed by 5♣ exclusion), 2♦ XYZ Game forcing relay or 3X natural GF slam try.
6430, is 4-4 fit enough?
#1
- World International Master without a clue
-
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 17,404
- Joined: 2003-November-13
- Gender:Male
- Location:madrid
Posted 2015-November-21, 15:18
Partner could still be balanced, options now are basically 4♣ splinter (could be followed by 5♣ exclusion), 2♦ XYZ Game forcing relay or 3X natural GF slam try.
#2
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 14,212
- Joined: 2009-July-13
- Location:England
Posted 2015-November-21, 16:15
You are slightly hamstrung by system here, it's much easier if 2♣ is simple 4th suit and 3♣ a splinter, also if you knew partner was unbalanced. Clearly you don't want to agree spades too early, partner could easily have something like Kxxx, Kx, AQJxx, xx which plays better in diamonds or hearts. I guess 2♦ to start.
#3
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 1,488
- Joined: 2006-March-23
- Gender:Male
Posted 2015-November-21, 16:41
I'd go with 2D also
The artist formerly known as jlall
#4
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 3,568
- Joined: 2006-June-28
- Gender:Male
- Location:Barrington IL USA
- Interests:Backgammon, Bridge, Hockey
Posted 2015-November-21, 22:07
Love XYZ so lets get more info and bid 2♦ here.
#5
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 1,488
- Joined: 2006-March-23
- Gender:Male
Posted 2015-November-22, 00:33
neilkaz, on 2015-November-21, 22:07, said:
Love XYZ so lets get more info and bid 2♦ here.
XYZ is terrible for GF hands, as per Cyberyeti
The artist formerly known as jlall
#6
- World International Master without a clue
-
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 17,404
- Joined: 2003-November-13
- Gender:Male
- Location:madrid
Posted 2015-November-22, 00:59
partner will rebid 2NT showing 4243 with club stopper or something like.
#7
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 16,826
- Joined: 2003-October-07
- Gender:Male
Posted 2015-November-22, 01:45
nonexpert here
4c
granted I have huge hand that pard will not know
I think 2d gf on this deal just complicates..
4c
granted I have huge hand that pard will not know
I think 2d gf on this deal just complicates..
#8
- Andy Bowles
-
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 11,993
- Joined: 2007-May-03
- Gender:Male
- Location:London, UK
Posted 2015-November-22, 03:01
Fluffy, on 2015-November-22, 00:59, said:
aArtner will rebid 2NT showing 4243 with club stopper or something like.
Can he also be 4153, or would that hand do something else?
... that would still not be conclusive proof, before someone wants to explain that to me as well as if I was a 5 year-old. - gwnn
#9
- Experimental biddicist
-
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 1,909
- Joined: 2010-January-02
- Gender:Male
Posted 2015-November-22, 04:47
Fluffy, on 2015-November-21, 15:18, said:
4♣ splinter (could be followed by 5♣ exclusion)
Hijacking the topic for a moment, under what circumstances would your 5♣ rebid be exclusion after the splinter? Only on your subsequent bid/on any later bid (except an RKCB response)/other? I've not heard of non-jump exclusion before, but it sounds like a useful gadget.
The "4♥ is a transfer to 4♠" award goes to Jinksy - PhilKing
#10
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 14,212
- Joined: 2009-July-13
- Location:England
Posted 2015-November-22, 10:26
Fluffy, on 2015-November-22, 00:59, said:
aArtner will rebid 2NT showing 4243 with club stopper or something like.
What's the difference between 3♥ now and 3♥ instead of 2♦ ?
#11
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 1,168
- Joined: 2012-May-17
- Gender:Male
- Location:Cincinnati Unit 124
- Interests:Family, Travel, Bridge Tournaments and Writing. Youth Bridge
Posted 2015-November-22, 12:28
Fluffy, I follow Cyberyeti's method where 3♣ here would be a splinter. Therefore 4♣ exclusion - what I want to bid.
Be the partner you want to play with.
Trust demands integrity, balance and collaboration.
District 11
Unit 124
Steve Moese
Trust demands integrity, balance and collaboration.
District 11
Unit 124
Steve Moese
#12
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 1,316
- Joined: 2011-March-01
- Gender:Male
- Interests:student of the game
Posted 2015-November-22, 16:09
Fluffy, on 2015-November-21, 15:18, said:
Partner could still be balanced, options now are basically 4♣ splinter (could be followed by 5♣ exclusion), 2♦ XYZ Game forcing relay or 3X natural GF slam try.
Am I the only seeing that Fluffy has posted the East hand?
Should that hand not be South?
#13
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 1,488
- Joined: 2006-March-23
- Gender:Male
Posted 2015-November-22, 16:14
jogs, on 2015-November-22, 16:09, said:
Am I the only seeing that Fluffy has posted the East hand?
Should that hand not be South?
Should that hand not be South?
Yeah man I don't know how anyone managed to respond to the question with that crucial error. It's on par with responding to a 12 card hand!
The artist formerly known as jlall
#14
- World International Master without a clue
-
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 17,404
- Joined: 2003-November-13
- Gender:Male
- Location:madrid
Posted 2015-November-22, 17:05
Cyberyeti, on 2015-November-22, 10:26, said:
What's the difference between 3♥ now and 3♥ instead of 2♦ ?
3♥ delayed suggest trumps, direct would impose it. If you try it partner bids 4♣ control implying ♥Hx, not denying spade control.
#15
- World International Master without a clue
-
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 17,404
- Joined: 2003-November-13
- Gender:Male
- Location:madrid
Posted 2015-November-22, 17:06
gnasher, on 2015-November-22, 03:01, said:
Can he also be 4153, or would that hand do something else?
Good clubs and bad diamonds yes, but normally 2♠ with that shape. (3♦ with very good suit also possible)
#16
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 14,212
- Joined: 2009-July-13
- Location:England
Posted 2015-November-22, 18:50
Fluffy, on 2015-November-22, 17:05, said:
3♥ delayed suggest trumps, direct would impose it. If you try it partner bids 4♣ control implying ♥Hx, not denying spade control.
When you say Hx is Jx enough or is H AKQ ?
If I can be sure of ♥Kx I bid 4♦.
Do I have any clue about partner's range yet ?
#17
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 1,316
- Joined: 2011-March-01
- Gender:Male
- Interests:student of the game
Posted 2015-November-22, 19:02
Fluffy, on 2015-November-21, 15:18, said:
Partner could still be balanced, options now are basically 4♣ splinter (could be followed by 5♣ exclusion), 2♦ XYZ Game forcing relay or 3X natural GF slam try.
If partner holds ♠KQ and ♥K, these hands fit like a glove. Unfortunately bridge is an imperfect information game short of peeking there is no way of knowing the pertinent information.
#18
- World International Master without a clue
-
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 17,404
- Joined: 2003-November-13
- Gender:Male
- Location:madrid
Posted 2015-November-23, 00:51
Cyberyeti, on 2015-November-22, 18:50, said:
When you say Hx is Jx enough or is H AKQ ?
If I can be sure of ♥Kx I bid 4♦.
Do I have any clue about partner's range yet ?
If I can be sure of ♥Kx I bid 4♦.
Do I have any clue about partner's range yet ?
Partner has 12-14 balanced. ♥9x would be enough if he feels rest of his hand is very good in context for playing hearts, but normally ♥Kx or ♥Jx is to be expected. Partner will keep cuebidding, 4♠ for you.
#19
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 3,092
- Joined: 2005-June-27
Posted 2015-November-23, 02:35
PhantomSac, on 2015-November-22, 00:33, said:
XYZ is terrible for GF hands, as per Cyberyeti
Would you mind elaborating a bit why you think XYZ is terrible for GF hands?
Which alternatives are better?
Rainer Herrmanno
#20
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 14,212
- Joined: 2009-July-13
- Location:England
Posted 2015-November-23, 03:40
rhm, on 2015-November-23, 02:35, said:
Would you mind elaborating a bit why you think XYZ is terrible for GF hands?
Which alternatives are better?
Rainer Herrmanno
Which alternatives are better?
Rainer Herrmanno
In this sequence it probably doesn't matter, but being able to bid 2♦ over 2♣ 4SF rather than having to bid over 2♦ could make a lot of difference in terms of space.