[gqc6]

In a Regional A/X Swiss, we are at 3rd and in 5th round ..

All Red, N deals, Basic approach is 2/1
N holds ♠ AJx ♥ K ♦ Axx ♣ AKJxxx
S holds ♠ Kxx ♥ AQJxx ♦ KTxx ♣ x

At the table, N decides to open an off-shape 2N, and auction goes 3D(transfer) 3H 4D 6C 6H

The contract is down on 6-1 heart break and basically cost us ~25Imps. (Other table didn't bid the slam.) Club is 4-2 with Q on so both 6C and 6N are making.
Just looking at 2 hands it seems 6H is a decent spot as 4-3 split is easy and we can handle 5-2 with friendly club situation.

We also discussed the possibility to open 1C and fake a reverse, but it doesn't seem to go anywhere. We play optional minorwood.

What could we do better in this auction? Or maybe it is a reasonable spot just unlucky?

[mike777]

very difficult hand.

PRefer 1c then 2d

after a messy messy auction expect to end up in 6nt

to strong for 1c then 3c


very difficult hand

1c=1h
2d=3d(gf)
??

----



alternative auction might be:

1c=1h
2nt(19-20)=6nt


in any case I think all roads lead to 6nt on some messy auction.

[gqc6]

1c then 2nt would show 18-19. I don't like blasting 6n directly.. There could easily be a much better slam.
In fact just looking at single dummy, is 6H better than 6N here?

mike777, on 2016-June-07, 22:47, said:

very difficult hand.

PRefer 1c then 2d

after a messy messy auction expect to end up in 6nt

to strong for 1c then 3c


very difficult hand

1c=1h
2d=3d(gf)
??

----



alternative auction might be:

1c=1h
2nt(19-20)=6nt


in any case I think all roads lead to 6nt on some messy auction.

[mike777]

Not sure what your question is, I think all roads lead to 6nt granted a messy auction that I do not brag about.

If you get to 6h ok.

[bigbenvic]

gqc6, on 2016-June-07, 21:00, said:

In a Regional A/X Swiss, we are at 3rd and in 5th round ..

All Red, N deals, Basic approach is 2/1
N holds ♠ AJx ♥ K ♦ Axx ♣ AKJxxx
S holds ♠ Kxx ♥ AQJxx ♦ KTxx ♣ x

At the table, N decides to open an off-shape 2N, and auction goes 3D(transfer) 3H 4D 6C 6H

The contract is down on 6-1 heart break and basically cost us ~25Imps. (Other table didn't bid the slam.) Club is 4-2 with Q on so both 6C and 6N are making.
Just looking at 2 hands it seems 6H is a decent spot as 4-3 split is easy and we can handle 5-2 with friendly club situation.

We also discussed the possibility to open 1C and fake a reverse, but it doesn't seem to go anywhere. We play optional minorwood.

What could we do better in this auction? Or maybe it is a reasonable spot just unlucky?

The 6-1 break is unlucky but 6H seems a poor bid to me, 6c had to be a choice between clubs and NT surely? AQJxx is 1 heart short for me to suggest that slam. I would just bid 6nt over 6♣ as if partner had any interest in my suits he wouldn't jump like that.

I think I'd rather open 1♣ and bid 2nt even if 18-19, I loathe reversing into a 3 card suit, I am all for bidding a lower minor with 3 to solve hard hands though. Over 2nt he is now in charge as my hand is limited, so 3♦ allows me to deny a heart fit a diamond fit and 6nt seems any easy spot to get to now. I don't mind 2nt as an opener on that shape with a stiff king, but understand why many don't.

[Cyberyeti]

bigbenvic, on 2016-June-08, 03:09, said:

The 6-1 break is unlucky but 6H seems a poor bid to me, 6c had to be a choice between clubs and NT surely? AQJxx is 1 heart short for me to suggest that slam. I would just bid 6nt over 6♣ as if partner had any interest in my suits he wouldn't jump like that.

Well his pard opened 2N so he's expecting to be opposite Kx where AQJxx is fine

[rhm]

bigbenvic, on 2016-June-08, 03:09, said:

The 6-1 break is unlucky but 6H seems a poor bid to me, 6c had to be a choice between clubs and NT surely? AQJxx is 1 heart short for me to suggest that slam.
I would just bid 6nt over 6♣ as if partner had any interest in my suits he wouldn't jump like that.

Why could opener not have ♠AJx ♥Kx ♦Ax ♣AKJxxx and 6♥ is a very good contract.

Quote

I think I'd rather open 1♣ and bid 2nt even if 18-19, I loathe reversing into a 3 card suit, I am all for bidding a lower minor with 3 to solve hard hands though. Over 2nt he is now in charge as my hand is limited, so 3♦ allows me to deny a heart fit a diamond fit and 6nt seems any easy spot to get to now. I don't mind 2nt as an opener on that shape with a stiff king, but understand why many don't.

I disagree entirely.
2NT is a clear underbid, not even forcing, particularly after a 1♥ response. It just shows the same hand as a 2NT opening only in the 18-19 range.
If you loathe reversing into a 3 card suit you would have to jump to 3NT, which at least properly describes this hand, a strong club suit just short of opening 2♣.

2NT opening was a poor choice.
There are too many flaws.
A singleton, a very strong six card minor combined with very good controls on the side.
It is the combination of these flaws, which reinforce each other and make a 2NT opening unattractive.
This hand is simply too suitable for a high level trump contract to open 2NT.
Opening 2NT could easily lead to 3NT down, while slam in clubs (or diamonds) might be cold.

The sensible options are 1♣ and over 1♥ continue either with 2♦ or 3NT.
With a good partner I prefer 3NT over 1♥, because it describes this hand very well.

Rainer Herrmann

[shyams]

rhm, on 2016-June-08, 04:24, said:

2NT opening was a poor choice.
There are too many flaws.

A singleton, a very strong six card minor combined with very good controls on the side.
It is the combination of these flaws, which reinforce each other and make 2NT unattractive.
This hand is simply too suitable for a high level trump contract to open 2NT.
Opening 2NT could easily lead to 3NT down, while slam in clubs (or diamonds) might be cold.

The sensible options are 1♣ and over 1♥ continue either with 2♦ or 3NT.

I am not convinced that 2NT was a poor choice. I would argue that it was a reasonable opening bid, the singleton ♥K made it right.

I suspect some of the criticism for 2NT on this thread (and I don't mean rhm alone) is due to the strong South hand and slam opportunities. If one were to visualise weak or intermediate hands for South, the 2NT opening could turn out to be a winning action.

In my view, the bids that deserves further inspection are South's 4♦ and North's 6♣.
* South's 4♦ is a matter of partnership agreement. For example, if South had 3♠ available to show slammish hands, it would allow more space for exploration.
* North's 6♣ appears to be an attempt to atone for the sin of opening 2NT with a singleton. IMO, there was no need to rush -- a 5♣ bid followed by a 6♣ bid (over partner's expected 5♥) would probably convey this hand type.

In the end, I think a chunk of the "blame" goes to luck. A 4-3 ♥ split would make 6♥ a great contract... and that's not asking a lot.

[akwoo]

shyams, on 2016-June-08, 05:09, said:

* North's 6♣ appears to be an attempt to atone for the sin of opening 2NT with a singleton. IMO, there was no need to rush -- a 5♣ bid followed by a 6♣ bid (over partner's expected 5♥) would probably convey this hand type.

Doesn't work. I think most people would play 5♣ there as an implied cue for diamonds, so 5♣ followed by 6♣ shows something like

♠Qxx ♥Ax ♦ AQxxx ♣AKx

(assuming partner made some show of a spade control over 5♣)

[antonylee]

I claim responsibility for opening 2N :-)

4♦ showed a (real) second suit by partnership agreement, so that seems appropriate here. We had no agreement about a direct 6♣ but as mentioned by akwoo, 5♣ would (likely?) be a cue for diamonds after which it would be hard to convey the excellent club suit.

1♣ followed by 2♦ may sound attractive but where do you go after
1♣-1♥
2♦-3♦ (positive)
?
(by agreement, 4♦ by either player would now be optional minorwood, asking partner whether he likes his hand for slam purposes and, if he does, how many keycards he holds.)

[ggwhiz]

1♣ followed by 2♦ for me to an eventual 6nt.

I open off shape 2nt often enough but NEVER with a stiff in a major that partner always transfers to. Quite unlucky on this one though.

[bigbenvic]

Cyberyeti, on 2016-June-08, 04:00, said:

Well his pard opened 2N so he's expecting to be opposite Kx where AQJxx is fine

However his partner jumped to 6♣ which is a red flag and at best he has xx in hearts. The jump is so extreme that I would be expecting something closer to AQx xx AQ AKJxxx as you are using up a lot of space and when you do that in a non competitive auction you should reserve it for a narrow range of hand types, here it should be 6 card suit and no tolerance (Jx or worse though you have the J so xx at best) for the primary suit, though 3 in the second suit is possible.

I agree RHM in hindsight 3nt would be the much better rebid after 1♣-1♥ but I tend to use that as a solid suit AKQxxx or better as you are saying I have good points and a running suit (even though it doesn't always run!) on this hand if I have to fib that's a much better one.

6H on AQJxx might be fine if you know he has the K♥ but unless you are coughing, board tilting or other then I think it's a wrong bid in this auction.

[rmnka447]

I think South should pass 6 ♣.

South has already bid what's in the hand. A transfer to ♥ followed by 4 ♦ must show slam interest and 5 ♥/4+ ♦. If North wanted to suggest or play a slam in ♥ then certainly 5 ♥ or 6 ♥ are available. And by bidding both red suits, South implies shortness in the black suits.

North's bid of 6 ♣ isn't asking, it's telling. It says "I've heard the description on your hand and I want to play 6 ♣." If North goes down because South has a singleton ♣, that's North's problem.

The moral is that when partner does something unusual, don't "save" partner. There may be good reason for partner doing what they did. Since you don't know for sure what's in partner's hand, you must trust that partner made the right decision.

[rmnka447]

Cyberyeti, on 2016-June-08, 04:00, said:

Well his pard opened 2N so he's expecting to be opposite Kx where AQJxx is fine

South can't know that North has ♥ Kx on this bidding. That's putting cards in partner's hand that it's not possible to know by bridge logic. That's a violation of good bidding principles.

[wank]

you got to the best contract. well done.

[Cyberyeti]

rmnka447, on 2016-June-09, 16:50, said:

South can't know that North has ♥ Kx on this bidding. That's putting cards in partner's hand that it's not possible to know by bridge logic. That's a violation of good bidding principles.

Well there are only say 5-7 points missing and some of them are in clubs as that suit is not solid or he'd have bid 1♣/3N, also it looks like pd is 3226 so he's missing at least J♦, thus he's about 6:1 on to hold K♥.

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

maybe opener should have bid 6NT over 6H?

I would not have opened 2NT, but I have seen worse opening bids.

But opener knowes, that he has only singleton king of trumps,
... but if he wants trumps to establish the clubs, passing 6H is
understandable, and the suggestion to convert to 6NT is just hinsight.

With kind regards
Marlowe