[jillybean]

Scoring: MP

1♦ (1♠) ?

---

Not playing NFB's - your bid?

[Cascade]

2♥ boring and normal and forcing

[andy_h]

Yeap 2♥. You may want to blast 4♥ shutting out LHO for a spade raise to induce them into a sacrifice but I don't think that's very likely nor wise. We have 8 of these hearts so I would definitely want to search for a slam. The ideal minimum hand we want partner to have is xx xxx AKxx Axxx. So 2♥ now and await for developments.

[the hog]

2H

[effervesce]

2♥.

[jillybean]

jillybean, on Sep 2 2009, 10:23 PM, said:

Scoring: MP

1♦ (1♠) ?

---

Not playing NFB's - your bid?

Ok

1♦ (1♠) 2♥ (P)
2N (P) ?

[mtvesuvius]

2♥, no reason to clog an artery thinking about this one
4♥ now

[ArtK78]

2♥ over 1♠.

3♠ now, intending to bid 4♥ later.

This hand will produce slam opposite an opening bid packed with controls with three of the following four cards - the missing three aces and the ♥Q (assuming that partner does not have A or Ax of spades) and a grand slam if partner has all four. I am going to let partner know that I am not bidding 4♥ on a moderate hand with AKxxxxxx of hearts.

I find that merely bidding 4♥ at this point or at the first chance to bid is a gross underbid. There is no rush. We can always get to 4♥ later.

[mcphee]

2H is surely the only sensible beginning. After 2NT 3S with the intention of bidding 4H over the expected 3N reply. I am not driving to slam, but I sure have itchy feet and want to let partner know I have the goods.

[jillybean]

jillybean, on Sep 2 2009, 10:23 PM, said:

Scoring: MP

1♦ (1♠) ?

---

Not  playing NFB's - your bid?

It started ok

1♦ (1♠) 2♥ (P)
2N (P)

This is where it went off the rails and I ended up in 6♥, missing 2 aces Its too painful to post the actual auction. I fell in love with my hand, shut partner out of the auction and forged ahead.

Im still thinking slam so 4♥ seems like an underbid, how can I check for 6 safely and keep partner in the picture.. what is 3♠?

[ArtK78]

jillybean, on Sep 3 2009, 11:37 AM, said:

This is where it went off the rails and I ended up in 6♥, missing 2 aces 

Im still thinking slam so 4♥ seems like an underbid.. what is 3♠?

A cue bid.

You want to differentiate between a hand on which you would bid 4♥, a hand with a long suit and moderate values, say:

xx AKT9xxx Kx xx

and a hand like yours which is at least one, probably two, tricks more powerful. So you cue bid and then bid 4♥. If partner has a lot of controls, he may be able to continue on.

[jillybean]

A cue bid in what, how does partner respond?

[andy_h]

Over 2NT I will bid 3♠ which is artificial and forcing. By process of elimination (for this auction) it's pretty much showing a self suited hand. That is, if we had clubs we bid 3♣ (forcing), if we want to sign off in diamonds we bid 3♦ and that goes with 3♥ as well, and if we wanted to set diamonds we can bid 4♦.

In some other auctions, 3♠ may consist of both meanings (slam try in hearts or diamonds) and usually partner will bid 3NT and over that we remove to 4♦ to set diamonds or bid 4♣ suggesting self suited hand with a club control. For example, that auction might be 1♦-(1♠)-2♥-(2♠)-3♦-(Pass)-3♠. This 3♠ actually has a 3rd function, in that it is also a stopper ask. In this type of auction opener should always assume it is asking for a stopper, because if opener bids 3NT and responder removes that, it will tell opener that the intended meaning of 3♠ was a slam try.

[ONEferBRID]

jillybean, on Sep 3 2009, 11:37 AM, said:

jillybean, on Sep 2 2009, 10:23 PM, said:

Scoring: MP

1♦ (1♠) ?

---

Not  playing NFB's - your bid?

It started ok

1♦ (1♠) 2♥ (P)
2N (P)

This is where it went off the rails and I ended up in 6♥, missing 2 aces Its too painful to post the actual auction. I fell in love with my hand, shut partner out of the auction and forged ahead.

Im still thinking slam so 4♥ seems like an underbid, how can I check for 6 safely and keep partner in the picture.. what is 3♠?

I'm unsure about a SELF-splinter here when there is interference.
First, the background with NO interference:

1D - 1H
1NT - 3S/4C/4D are SELF-splinters for Responder's suit ( Hts ).

So, I'm wondering in the present auction:

1♦ (1♠) 2♥ (P)
2N (P)  ??

would 4C/4D be self splinters here? ( 4S!- jump cue definitely would be ).
3C would be forcing ( new suit at 3-level by unpassed partner), thus 4C is a jump over a force which would qualifiy it as a splinter.
But only if 3D were a forcing bid ( and I don't think it is ) would a 4D-jump qualify as a splinter.

Therefore, my own conclusion, much as I dislike it, is that 4D would not be a splinter.

So I'm stuck with the 3S-cue for now at this point.... and then 4H next over the expected 3NT ( as the others have mentioned )

- - Don - -

[gwnn]

agree with the **** volcano

[jillybean]

gwnn, on Sep 3 2009, 11:25 AM, said:

agree with the **** volcano

4♥? I expected much more from you!

[pooltuna]

andy_h, on Sep 3 2009, 11:58 AM, said:

In some other auctions, 3♠ may consist of both meanings (slam try in hearts or diamonds) and usually partner will bid 3NT and over that we remove to 4♦ to set diamonds or bid 4♣ suggesting self suited hand with a club control. For example, that auction might be 1♦-(1♠)-2♥-(2♠)-3♦-(Pass)-3♠. This 3♠ actually has a 3rd function, in that it is also a stopper ask. In this type of auction opener should always assume it is asking for a stopper, because if opener bids 3NT and responder removes that, it will tell opener that the intended meaning of 3♠ was a slam try.

Quote

Over 2NT I will bid 3♠ which is artificial and forcing. By process of elimination (for this auction) it's pretty much showing a self suited hand. That is, if we had clubs we bid 3♣ (forcing), if we want to sign off in diamonds we bid 3♦ and that goes with 3♥ as well, and if we wanted to set diamonds we can bid 4♦.

If 3♦ is non forcing why did you bid 2♥? I mean if you are worried about not being able to show a ♥ suit maybe you should use a negative double. IMO 3♦ is 1000% forcing. This frees up 4♦ to be what it should be....a ♥ self-splinter

[Cascade]

With most of 9 tricks and a partner who opened the bidding I have too much to just bid 4♥ now.

So I am with the 3♠ bidders.

I agree also that on this particular auction that partner should be able to work out that I am single-suited with hearts. That might depend on partnership understandings as it would be possible in theory to make an advanced cue-bid of spades before agreeing partner's suit.

[gwnn]

jillybean, on Sep 3 2009, 08:46 PM, said:

gwnn, on Sep 3 2009, 11:25 AM, said:

agree with the **** volcano

4♥? I expected much more from you!

maybe it's a bit too pessimistic. I'm generally pessimistic when it comes to slam vs game and optimistic otherwise.

[ArtK78]

pooltuna, on Sep 3 2009, 02:02 PM, said:

andy_h, on Sep 3 2009, 11:58 AM, said:

In some other auctions, 3♠ may consist of both meanings (slam try in hearts or diamonds) and usually partner will bid 3NT and over that we remove to 4♦ to set diamonds or bid 4♣ suggesting self suited hand with a club control. For example, that auction might be 1♦-(1♠)-2♥-(2♠)-3♦-(Pass)-3♠. This 3♠ actually has a 3rd function, in that it is also a stopper ask. In this type of auction opener should always assume it is asking for a stopper, because if opener bids 3NT and responder removes that, it will tell opener that the intended meaning of 3♠ was a slam try.

Quote

Over 2NT I will bid 3♠ which is artificial and forcing. By process of elimination (for this auction) it's pretty much showing a self suited hand. That is, if we had clubs we bid 3♣ (forcing), if we want to sign off in diamonds we bid 3♦ and that goes with 3♥ as well, and if we wanted to set diamonds we can bid 4♦.

If 3♦ is non forcing why did you bid 2♥? I mean if you are worried about not being able to show a ♥ suit maybe you should use a negative double. IMO 3♦ is 1000% forcing. This frees up 4♦ to be what it should be....a ♥ self-splinter

A 2/1 in competition is not game forcing in Standard systems. It does promise a rebid, but that is about it.

A later preference to partner's first suit is non-forcing. So I disagree with your conclusion that 2♥ followed by 3♦ is forcing. I also disagree with your conclusion that 4♦ would be a self-splinter. To me, 4♦ would be a maximum confusion bid - the one bid guaranteed to mess up the auction.